Last updated: 
16 August 2019

This is the transcript for the video: Transactional Digital Services Program: Fourth reference community webinar

Josh Burns, IP Australia

Hi all, welcome to our August edition of our Reference Group webinar. It's great to see such high levels of interest. We've got another new record of attendees today, which is really good. Again, for people that have joined us before in previous webinars, I'll just go through some very brief housekeeping in terms of what to expect today. So, we're using GoToWebinar for today's session. It's best that we leave any questions that you may have along the way for the end of the presentation. Now, we've got a demo early on for our new trade mark application API. Cam will run that, but again, we might wait until the end of his demonstration for specific questions about that demo. So, we'll get to that in a second.

The webinar today should be fairly quick, should run for about 30 minutes depending on how many questions and so forth we get, we're again wary that we don't want to waste your time to eat at lunch time. If you guys can't hear us or view our shared screens during the broadcast, please let us know. You can do that via sort of asking us a text question, or raising your hands. The webinar today, again like others, will be recorded and available on our website after the session.

We'll send an email at the conclusion of today's event with that detail. So in terms of today's agenda, again like I said it's going to be fairly quick today. Just going over a couple of things, in our last TDS webinar event was held in June on the 13th, again if you're a new participant today you can catch up on all of our webinars on our website. We've got a link that we'll send out after today's session, and that gives a bit of a connection to other resources available on our website about our API program.

So today's session, Cam as I said, our test lead, he's going to run us through a technical demonstration of the current version of Trade mark New Application API that we've got in a test space. We'll talk about the context of that demonstration when we get to it with Cam but essentially it's our first version of the Trade mark New App and it has a few components missing at this stage. But we'll get to that when we hit the demonstration. I'll run through it, a very high level program update including the API's in current development and what you can expect to be released in the coming months.

We'll have a bit of a glimpse into our updated delivery road map and that'll have some internal API stuff involved, but I'll speak to that when we get to it. I'll also take you guys through some of the new refined content that we've deployed in the AnyPoint Development portal, and we're keen on showing you guys where that refined content is, it's got a bit of a business focus, so it takes you through some of the definitions of each of the instances and some flows that make a bit more sense to the less technical user in this space going forward.

We just want a bit of feedback on that information going forward, and we want to continue to refine that content to make sure that the experience is quite straightforward for developers but also business focused consumers. We then got a quick poll to measure engagement, we want to do this just to make sure that we're delivering the right things at the right time, so that's just a very quick one question poll.

Then we'll talk about what is next from a reference group perspective, then we'll do some Q&A at the end and let you guys go. So that's what's on the agenda today. We'll get straight into it with an API demonstration, so as I mentioned, we deployed a limited version, we're calling it a MVP or minimal viable product version of Trade mark New Application API, and to test ... it was in early July, on the 9th of July so the API's currently available in test but there are significant limitations with the current version.

The limited API instance at the moment allows a user to submit a word, a logo mark, allows multiple trade mark kinds, plain text, figurative, movement, sound et cetera. Allows for goods and services selection, and obviously submission of timing of that application. What we don't actually have at the moment, is part of that test API instance is the ability to create an applicant or owner, which is fairly critical obviously. But we're working on a new customer management, or identity management solution internally. And we're currently configuring and implementing that as we speak.

We're hopeful that we'll have something in a usable test form in probably the next six to eight weeks roughly. We'll keep you posted on news around that. Another news around, just before Cam gets to demonstrating this API, there's trade mark types that we're currently building, and we're hoping to release in the next week or two. So that will, once we plug in the customer component in six to eight weeks, that'll complete the Trade mark New Application build. We'd love you guys to jump in and test this stuff, and one thing to keep note of is, while it's not usable in tests currently by creating a new applicant, we can actually provide you relevant data to use if you did want to start doing some functional testing in that space now.

In the lead up to plugging the customer solution in, so testing is still possible. I understand it might not be reflective of a new customer solution being plugged in but if you wanted to have a look and feel and play around we can certainly assist. So next couple of things just to make note of, again any questions that you guys have during the demonstration, let's just leave them until Cam is finished, then we'll take some questions on. Cam, whenever you're ready we'll switch over to you and I guess just as a lead in, this will be fairly technically focused demonstration. But any questions outside of that business focused participants, feel free we can take them offline and catch up after today's webinar about exactly what Cam is showing.

Thanks Cam.

Cameron Alchin, IP Australia

Yeah, so just leading in from Josh. Josh thank for the the intro there, I'll be giving a tentative more technical demonstration on what we've delivered in terms of Trade mark New Applications and the API's we've got in place to submit those. So as Josh said, there's currently some limitations, which I'll take you through in a second, in terms of being able to use these in tests. But there is definitely enough there for people to do active testing and the changes which Josh is referring to for the customer management solution should have very minimal impact on the actual trade mark API itself.

Obviously it would have an impact on generating customers and customer ID's, so just to kick off there, I might just start with just a generic word application. So obviously the most basic trade mark application that you can have, and you guys are probably across at least a little bit about the way API's are working. What you can see now is obviously PostMan which is essentially a test harness for interacting with the API's and what we're using here for our testing.

Obviously, just an idea on what you may have on your end if you do build a solution, but it's just a good visualisation there. So basically, as per the spec in the design studio from MuleSoft, we've got all their trade mark details in the payload here. We call that the representation, is a word, which is a pure text mark, and whatever of the reference details you need in the application. For example, the owner identifies, which is the owner, or the applicant, of the trade mark. That is where the current limitation lies with this implementation.

Sorry, disregard me opening dictionary over and over again. So if you go to payload here, it's as simple as just sending the payload to the API endpoint, which I've got here. You'll see your 200 response and then the payload response body will include the batch ID, the trade mark application number, and whatever fee was payable for that mark. Obviously this is the exact same kind of set up we had. We had current B2B, or E services, solution ware, it's sort of financial theme so that is essentially very basic trade mark. Word mark works, we've also as Josh said, introduced functionality for the image marks and other types of marks.

For example, sounds, whatever it may be. Pretty much every type and kind of trademark is supported now in the test version. And I can show you guys quickly how that works in the TDS platform which is slightly different from how B2B and E services works. That is especially around what we're calling the attachment API, and that is essentially where you would be uploading any documents or representations which are relevant to the service request which you're submitting to IPA.

Again, that's just done through PostMan. I've indicated my file type and the file itself in the payload. And again, I'll just post that to IP Australia's endpoint. And then, in the response body you'll see you've got an attachment ID and an indication that you haven't actually submitted the service request but you have uploaded the file to IP Australia as a representation. And then, in the actual trade mark service request itself that is where you reference that document ID in the payload center of IP Australia. So you see here I'm referencing that document ID in my payload and is submitted to IP Australia the same as standard word marks.

You've got your batch ID there, and your payment as well, so that's probably a basic rundown of where trademark's is at. As Josh said, it's 90% flushed out in terms of functionality for testing that's available at the moment. So yeah, it would be great to get some people onboard there to get your feedback, and understanding of how that works. The only limitation being the customer solution but we've touched on that, and we're happy to take more questions on that probably in the future.

If you guys are interested in doing some testing prior to the customer solution being plugged in, just get in contact with me through any of the channels. Probably the TDS inbox, and we can work with you on providing you the relevant data to use in that functional testing.

Cool. That's probably it for me, but I might kick back to Josh and yeah I'll be around to answer anymore questions for probably a little while longer.

Josh Burns, IP Australia

So we've got a question here from Barney, does the New Trade mark filing have a validate option?

Yep. So definitely we offer the same validation and point that we do for all our service requests that we're building out now, on the back of some feedback that we've had so that's definitely an option. And for series marks, you upload multiple files. It is based on the attachment API's accepting individual files, you can upload as many as you want there and we'll hold them for a period of a few days, or I think it's up to five days at the moment.

The idea there being, you may want to upload all your representations there, and reference them, even do a validate call or something like that. And then when you're happy with the application, record the ID and send me the application. So hopefully that answers that question.

yeah so, in terms of ... sorry Barney's asked another question which around file types and size limitations, again it's very similar to E services however, we are endeavoring to scale up and allow a broader range of file types and size limits. Obviously the technology stack right now is a lot more modern than what we're using for E services and B2B. So whilst the validation is similar, we are accepting a broad arrange of file types and the bigger file sizes there.

So just on that one Cam, in terms of file sizes and more specifically, we are keen to scale up. We'd like your feedback about where you do have pain points around file sizes with specific transactions so if trade mark's is one of those please let us know through some feedback so we can do some work on scaling that up. The thing we have to be wary of is performance from our end but we'd rather take your feedback on at a specific level. So rather than just scaling up for every single transaction, it'd be good to know where we need to scale up.

One that comes to mind for me is design specs, multiple designs are quite high in terms of the sizes. But we'd love your feedback on attachment sizes generally. So get in contact with us please.

Got another question, asking is there an equivalent to the E services picklist for goods and services, yeah there definitely is that exact principle in the TDS functionality as well, the PostMan screen on the left is very hard to use but I'll try and show you guys in the payload where you can see that information.

We've actually got an isolated trade mark goods and services API instance itself.


So what Cam will show is where we call that API but you can also call that API outside this process to update data at your end, in terms of the next classification model. That trade mark, I think it's called trade mark G&S API is available as an instance on our AnyPoint platform, if you guys have any questions around that after today's session please, again, get in contact and we can take you through it. We can do some showcases about how it works, that sort of thing.

Yes, so hopefully you can see on your screen there the payload kind of showing. You can see the peak list indicator there is set to true, and above that I've given the class number, which is class 12, and the description which is off the pick list. So for example, if I was to change the class item to something that's not on the pick list, we'll validate that and throw you guys back a response to say, "Hey, you've indicated that this is on the pick list but it's not truly and vise versa."

We've definitely got a very similar validation of E services, the advantage of the API is being that we're telling you guys that up front. If you're a B2B customer you would know that currently you provide us the list and we get back to you at a later date. Where as this we provide the validation at the front door.

So another question has come in here from Barney about is there an API plan which would concern valid file types and sizes? I guess that's something ... I don't know if you can answer that Cam.

So we probably won't serve that up as an API specifically. Obviously you can call the validate end point and find out whether it meets the requirements but obviously this part of documentation we're putting together we will list the accepted file types and sizes for each service request.

But the attachment API itself should provide many full responses around what is valid and what isn't validated around sizes and formats.

Yeah, attachment API will tell you yeah it's too small, or the quality of the image is too low, or whatever it may be.

Is there a plan to release a trade mark search for similar types of marks? Smart search.

Maybe that question we could take offline and respond to. I think if your question, Barney, is there around whether you can validate the application itself that you're putting in against the register, if that's something you're getting at currently no. We don't have that, but again, we're always open for feedback and those sorts of things we can help out with definitely.


Send us some feedback or -

We'll document that and we can get in touch with you guys about what you want to see in terms of enhancements and that sort of thing. Any other questions guys? We might let Cam run off. Again, like I said, we can have more high level questions at the end of today's webinar. Which aren't specific I guess to the trade mark API.

All right, we might move on. Delivery road map is next. So I'll just take you guys through a rough high level view of where we're up to from a program standpoint. So we've got the delivery road map there on screen that we're sharing now. As you can see, it's going to be a busy 12 months ahead of us. Up there, as I mentioned during the agenda run through, there's some things that might not make a great deal of sense externally. Things like party management, some of our foundational API's that are up there.

Essentially a lot of those are the foundations that we're building upon, party management for example, would be that customer solution that we plug into Trade mark New Applications and patent the applications when we get to it. So I'll just run through quickly what is available in production in terms of API instances. So we've got IP right renewals, we've got patent examination requests which is full examination only at this point. We've got national phase entry which is limited just to valid or in time national phase entries at this point.

So we're looking to optimise that in the next sprint or two with regards to attachments, billing entry, non English translations, article 19 and 34 amendments, that sort of thing. We've got requests for post patent acceptance for patents in production. As I mentioned, we've got trade marks goods and services API, and the Australian trade mark search API in production currently. Under current development, we're building out the remaining functionality for national phase entry applications.

The same thing for patents examination request, so that'll include things like the PPH method of expediting exam requests, innovation exam requests, third party examination requests and so forth. And the New Trade mark Application API. In terms of what is on a future road development rise, we've got trade marks and patents examinations response, transaction which will be of significant interest, we've got trade marks and patents amendments, a broad category. A very complex category that we're going to attack very soon, patents invitation to pay, extension of time across the board. Which again, will be fairly complex.

Correspondence which will be one that is critical for our existing and new customers, and new patent applications. So once that customer and management solution is implemented and we plug in to Trade mark New Apps, we'll start building patent new applications. The design and plant breeder's rights business line development is slated for a little bit later but we've got some room there in our delivery road map for some data applications there. So we may, if we get time, start that work sooner and again we welcome your feedback on when our customers want to see that stuff commence development.

At the same time, we're working to a fairly tight schedule, if we were to bring something forward, we might have to sacrifice something else to fit it in, that sort of thing. Again, we welcome feedback around the delivery road map, it's dynamic, it's something that is flexible and we can change. But we just need to go through a process to do that with some evidence from our customers. Again, as usual, if you're interested in providing feedback or becoming more involved in what we're doing please don't hesitate to get in touch with us.

We've got customers who have been heavily involved and we'll go through that in a second about a success story that have good influence out of what we're doing in terms of co design and providing great feedback for us and making sure that we're delivering what customers actually want to see and get value from. That's something that we'll continue and we really welcome.

Next slide guys, I've got ... apologies, I haven't set up the webpage that I want to show you but I will talk to it in the mean time, I might just get Liam to bring up an internet window for us, browsing window. Just to give you a bit of an intro to this next topic guys. Those who have been on our public portal in the Any Point space the MuleSoft development portal, you will know that our documentation has been quite lean and that's something that we're sort of working on refining.

From a technical standpoint, we're doing some refining but also from a business focus standpoint, trying to define what these API instances actually do with sort of diagrammatical type flows. How to call the API's, how security protocols, some definitions around how the API's are designed to behave, that sort of thing. We are trying to optimize that content to make the journey a little bit smoother. We've had feedback from customers around the portal itself and we're working with our vendor on optimizing the portal and upgrading the version to make the developer experience a little bit better navigationally.

It is hard to find certain things in the portal at times, so we're going to try and improve that with our vendor in the coming months so we'll keep you guys posted on where we get to on that. But in the interim we want to deliver better content and better education and guidance to our users. Again, if you guys can jump in and have a look at this content and provide us feedback, that would be ideal. I'll just ... again apologies for having to get to the webpage during the ... can you type that in Liam?

Sure. I know it's long.

You can go ahead and copy and paste it.

So I'll just keep talking while Liam gets to this page. So what I'm going to show you is our public portal, which again you don't have to be registered to access, and this link is available on our website in a variety of webpages that you can actually have a look at our technical specifications and our business content without actually committing to registering with MuleSoft at this point.

This public portal is available to all of you guys, once you have a look and you can progress, and you can then register or request a register with us and we can approve that process and provide you the credentials that you need to ... yeah in paid testing and what not. We might be able to get to it from there.

I might need ... no it won't have the public portal for us, we might not show it today. I might, with the email that we send out guys, sorry some technical problems, I will send out the link to our business focus content. It's mainly to show you guys where it actually is so you can find it first and foremost, but please have a look through that business focus content, let us know your feedback if this is of assistance from a technical or business focus nature. And we can certainly work with you on providing you what you need in that space.

One other thing in regards to content that I wanted to touch on was we recently got approval from our legal section, which took quite awhile, on our terms and conditions. So we've got terms and conditions as part of the developer portal now, and you guys again can see that. I'll send out a link in an email after this session today but you guys can access it by the public portal. The process in terms of accepting the terms and conditions is once you request access to our production API instances, it'll basically show you the terms and conditions, have a check box to accept upon onboarding into that channel.

Again we've got some detailed instructions on how to request access into the portal that will cover you step by step in terms of how to go about that process. Again, if you've got any questions please get in contact with me and I can hold your hands through that process. But it's fairly straightforward. The terms and conditions, I discovered are just broad terms and conditions, very similar to the terms and conditions on our E services platform, and our B2B agreement with our existing customers.

There's not a huge amount to note in there, but feel free to peruse it and let us know your feedback on those as well. I mentioned before, we want to share a customer success story, so recently we achieved a fairly significant milestone in the form of onboarding a production customer. The customer was Xenith IP, and taking the opportunity that we provided them to be heavily involved from an engagement perspective but also from a co-design perspective they're really taking the opportunity and sort of run with it from their space.

We thought today it might be good to hand over to Paul Bristow who is the applications manager at Xenith, to talk about their experience in onboarding to the API's, what it means to them, some of the effort involved, and obviously we've received great feedback from Xenith around our portal about some difficulties in the content and the navigation, that sort of thing. It's good from a share point perspective to share this information with potential customers for a little bit of knowledge and understanding and that sort of thing.

Paul, if you're ready we'll hand over the reins to you now, just for a very brief update, and then once you're done let me know and we can take control back.

Paul Bristow, Xenith IP

Thanks, Josh. Good afternoon everyone, as Josh mentioned my name's Paul Bristow currently at Xenith IP but formerly, I was with Griffith Hack and very soon to be with IPH. I thought I'd give you a little bit of background first, we've been on this journey for quite some time now with the guys from IP Australia. For us it started way back on the 25th of June 2012, that's when we first implemented our very NFT solution for Griffith Hack. That was to process renewals.

The next major milestone we hit was receiving IPA outbound electronic corro and we went live with that the very first day it became available via B2B. Casting my mind back, I recall right back at the start expressing our dislike for MFT software and asking when would IP Australia be able to expose some API's for us to consume. I guess the wait's finally over, and so as of last week we've been able to renew IP rights in their live environment.

We've been pretty happy with that, it's been really great with Josh and the team in IP Australia to get to this point. I look forward to going forward with that. I guess you ask why, why are we consuming these API's? The main drivers behind this are across the Xenith IP group we've got four instances of the NFT server. We've got full service to support that, and they're supported by lots of replicated processes to process in and outbound transactions.

We can now see the light at the end of the tunnel where all these legacies systems can now be decommissioned. Being able to use these API's will allow us to develop more sophisticated and integrated systems with IP Australia, and finally be able to transact with IP Australia in real time. And these benefits of being able to turn around and transaction in seconds rather than minutes, that's going to translate into real time savings for our support staff and interns as well.

We look forward to consuming any, and all API's that IP Australia make available to us, and we look forward to continuing this journey that we've been having with those guys. Thanks Josh for the opportunity to speak today, and thanks all. Cheers.

Josh Burns, IP Australia

Thank you for that, Paul. I appreciate that little update from an external customer perspective, it's good to hear the progress and we are thankful for the influence that you guys have had so far to our engagement and feedback channels that we've had. That's great, like I keep saying, for anyone who is interested in becoming more involved in the journey, the door is open, get in contact with us and we can set up workshops, we can set up demonstrations, that sort of thing.

Sort of gather your requirements from external perspectives so we can make sure we're delivering what you guys actually need. So we might just head on to the next slide. So it's quick poll time, from this end we'll just generate our one question poll, so again just for background on what this poll is, we are keen to insure that we are meeting your needs when it comes to our collaboration and engagement. We measure this as a baseline to make sure that we're doing the right level of engagement with you. Not overdoing it, and the content we're delivering you is satisfactory.

Please if you guys have a couple of minutes to complete that one question poll and we'll move ahead.

Let's give 30 seconds more and then we'll move on. Thank you to those who have completed it.

Okay, so we might move on. Thank you guys for helping us in that respect. In terms of ... let's go to next slide there Liam. In terms of what's next in our webinar space, our next webinar will be slated for October. At the moment we don't have an approximate date for that, or a definite date for that, but I'll keep posted to our website and through our subscription list, our email lists about when that will be. We'll also send through an agenda four weeks prior to the webinar happening. Now I keep saying I sound like a repeating record here, but if you're interested on being involved throughout this development with particular focus on Trade mark New Applications, or the trade mark examination response and patent examination transactions, again please get in touch.

You can do that through our program inbox, which is, you can find this email address via our website. The email that we send out post this session today will have all that information in it, but we look forward to increasing that co-design and influence element. We encourage you guys to get in contact and be part of this journey with us.

So next slide, so we're up to the questions. So if you guys have any other questions outside of the technical Trade mark New Applications space, feel free to send those through by text or use the raise your hand as it shows there on the slide. Then we'll close today's session up.

So we've just got a question through from Barney. And Barney asks is there any progress on the authentication issues through the MuleSoft platform? Again, yes there is progress there Barney so that's part of us wanting to work with our vendor on a more optimised experience but part of that is our identity management solution that we're currently implementing. For those that don't have the background, there is some authentication issues around logging in to AnyPoint platform. It sort of throws our internal authentication at external users which is not ideal, and is problematic.

I know it's been an issue for Barney, it's something we want to sort of get solved with this identity management solution and potential upgrade of the portal very soon. Hopefully that particular issue will only be around for the very near future.

So we've got another question in here, so for smaller firms with less programming resources, will the system be offered as a package template or desktop software that any company can run? It seems there is a lot of custom programming required at present. That's probably something that from a business perspective with ... we've definitely got to focus on those attorney firms or IP professionals that don't have developer resources. We'll try to connect you with appropriate ICT skilled developers in that space as well as we can.

In terms of offering a package or desktop software, that's something that we're happy to consider. I'll also take it back to our program manager and get a bit of an answer on that. But at the moment, that won't be available but it's something that we can definitely consider in terms of throwing something more accessible out there for IP professionals that don't have the luxury of having on-site developers. So it's a question I'll sort of take a little bit offline, but I'll raise it with our program manager for some consideration.

I'll just give you guys one more minute just for any other questions for today. Like I keep saying, if you guys have questions outside of this forum, don't hesitate to contact me through that TDS inbox, I'm happy to answer any questions you guys have. And the other thing to make mention of is our development team are available, so Cam was in today as our lead tester but we've got a very switched on development team who can arrange showcases or technical walkthroughs of our API instances in future if it's of value to you guys as customers. That's something that we can do at any point, and just do a video conference with you to answer any of the questions that you may have specifically around those API's.

Again, if that's something that you're interested in please reach out.

All right, we might wrap it up from this end Liam, I'm sorry we took a little bit longer than I expected but hopefully you guys got some value out of today. Again, we'll send an email out at the conclusion of today's webinar with some details on the program and also when the next ... send some information around when the next webinar will be. Please get in contact, it's been a good journey so far but we're only just getting started so we look forward to working with all of you guys.

Thank you for your participation today, and have a great day.